Features request

[pdussart]

Sir,

 

I am now using version 5.0 with a lot of success. I have been used to work with various tools.

I have used Extensis and Studioline Photo Basic for many years and find that somme of useful features are missing in Daminion:

 

1) Full support of IPTC fields.

I have seen elsewhere in this forum, that additional IPTC fields would be heavy for Daminion.

I would suggest to allow all IPTC fields management in TWO steps: light (as now) and heavy (complete).

 

2) Dates are not properly managed.

Show the tag "Date taken" and "Time taken"

This tag should never be updated, as generated at the time of the picture shot.

This original date is important in order to document correctly the files.

"Date created" can be different and refers to file improvement, resizing or other manipulation, possibly by Daminion.

 

3) Use variables extracted from EXIF/ITPC data.

You could generate Titles, Descriptions.

Example of title generation : "Photo" + #filename + ".' + #GPSlocation + "Date:" + #datetaken

or copy data from one field to another, for instance between Author and Copyright.

 

4) Manage JPG and RAW tags of the same image in one go

Like in View NX (Nikon tool), if the 2 types of files have the same name, you should be able to enter data in one go for the 2 files, so that tags are identical

 

5) Create an option "Update ALL documents".

Some updates work by 1.000 upto 5.000 documents.

I would allow an option ALL documents, with a warning message saying "this might be a long process"

Working by blocks might be useful for performance reasons, by the ALL options is required for ensuring completeness.

 

6) Message "Daminion busy"

If a long process is busy, you see circling arrows below the screen.

I would add in the middle of the screen a message saying "Daminion busy + a description of the process going on" I would also ensure that any entry is blocked. A security against crashes.

 

Regards, Philippe

[Uwe]

3) Use variables extracted from EXIF/ITPC data.

You could generate Titles, Descriptions.

Example of title generation : "Photo" + #filename + ".' + #GPSlocation + "Date:" + #datetaken

or copy data from one field to another, for instance between Author and Copyright.

This is already working. Please check the function Rename: Menu->Edit->Batch Rename(Move)->...

You can use these variables in the Assign Tag Presets function to create e.g. the Title Tag "Photo%filename_%lat_%lon"

 

4) Manage JPG and RAW tags of the same image in one go

Like in View NX (Nikon tool), if the 2 types of files have the same name, you should be able to enter data in one go for the 2 files, so that tags are identical

This is a function already available in the official 5.0 version, ready to download today

 

Regards, Uwe

[Uwe]

6) Message "Daminion busy"

If a long process is busy, you see circling arrows below the screen.

I would add in the middle of the screen a message saying "Daminion busy + a description of the process going on" I would also ensure that any entry is blocked. A security against crashes.

There are two different implementations to get information: by modal and non modal dialog. The modal dialog blocks the application as long as it takes to finish the started action (e.g. Assign Tag Presets). The non modal dialog works in the background/parallel and you can continue to work without to wait for the end of the started action (e.g. Rescan Folders).

Your request to get additional information in the middle of the screen means: modal dialog and you have to wait for the end of the action and you can't continue to work.

And you are right, there are feature requests to get more and detailled information about the current status of the prosess(es).

Regards, Uwe

[Uwe]

5) Create an option "Update ALL documents".

Some updates work by 1.000 upto 5.000 documents.

I would allow an option ALL documents, with a warning message saying "this might be a long process"

Working by blocks might be useful for performance reasons, by the ALL options is required for ensuring completeness.

 

Hello Philippe,

there is already an option to adjust the selected items or all items, e.g. if you assign a new tag in the Properties Panel.

Regards, Uwe

[Uwe]

2) Dates are not properly managed.

Show the tag "Date taken" and "Time taken"

This tag should never be updated, as generated at the time of the picture shot.

This original date is important in order to document correctly the files.

"Date created" can be different and refers to file improvement, resizing or other manipulation, possibly by Daminion.

Hello Philippe,

from my point of view one has to have the option to adjust the date and time. E.g. I've scanned a lot of paper or mounted slides (taken many years ago by an "analog camera" without exif data).

Depending on the scanner hardware date and time tags are created but their value is the day/time of the scan.

Or did I misunderstand your problem?

Regards, Uwe

[pdussart]

Hello Philippe,

from my point of view one has to have the option to adjust the date and time. E.g. I've scanned a lot of paper or mounted slides (taken many years ago by an "analog camera" without exif data).

Depending on the scanner hardware date and time tags are created but their value is the day/time of the scan.

Or did I misunderstand your problem?

Regards, Uwe

 

Uwe,

 

If your documents come from a camera, date taken is key.

If your camera is well set, the date and time should be correct, like GPS data.

I am shooting digital since 1999. To keep this date intact is important, as you might have "forgotten" images, or received images from other people. You might decide to process these images days or years after shooting them, but the original date should be recorded.

 

Date created" is another story.

If you scan or manipulate a document/file/image the "date created" is the date you used the scanner or say Photoshop.

You need papers or other information to "date" the document, and mention this date in the Title or description of the picture.

 

So if your parents took a picture of your birthday by 25/3/2005, the "date taken" should always be 25/3/2005.

If the pictures has been corrected, tagged some time later, the "date created" is useful to keep, for instance for versioning.

Other type of files might also require this distinction.

 

So I think that these two dates are important.

 

Regards, Philippe

[Uwe]

Hello Philippe,

is "date taken" = "DateTime Original"= for you? Just to avoid misunderstandings.

Regards, Uwe

[pdussart]

Hello Philippe,

there is already an option to adjust the selected items or all items, e.g. if you assign a new tag in the Properties Panel.

Regards, Uwe

 

Uwe,

 

This is about user friendlynesss and confidence in the tool, I guess.

 

I understand that some updates can be heavy and this is the purpose of these setups and warning messages.

But in my case, I would prefer to have the confidence that ALL is always selected, without warning of any kind.

 

If you do a bulk update over a catalog of say 12.000 images, with Daminion, tend to check whether ALL documents were effectively updated. I find a contradiction between the display in chunks of 5000 files and the effective update over ALL files. (what is ALL ? 5000 ? 12000 ?)

 

May be the solution is a message saying "You are updating xxx of 12000 files"

 

Regards, Philippe

[pdussart]

Hello Philippe,

is "date taken" = "DateTime Original"= for you? Just to avoid misunderstandings.

Regards, Uwe

 

Uwe,

 

See document in attachment.

 

I am speakng of two dates, I am using only Original and Modified. In fact three distinct dates should be managed.

 

- Date/time original specifies when a photo was taken

- Date/time digitized specifies when an image was digitized

- Date/time modified specifies when a file was modified by the user

 

 

 

Information for Date/Time (Original):

Exif DateTimeOriginal (36867, 0x9003) and SubSecTimeOriginal (37521, 0x9291)

IPTC DateCreated (IIM 2:55, 0x0237) and TimeCreated (IIM 2:60, 0x023C)

XMP (photoshop:DateCreated)

 

Digitized Date/Time – Creation date of the digital representation

Exif DateTimeDigitized (36868, 0x9004) and SubSecTimeDigitized (37522, 0x9292)

IPTC DigitalCreationDate (IIM 2:62, 0x023E) and DigitalCreationTime (IIM 2:63, 0x023F)

XMP (xmp:CreateDate)

 

Modification Date/Time – Modification date of the digital image file

Exif DateTime (306, 0x132) and SubSecTime (37520, 0x9290)

XMP (xmp:ModifyDate)

 

Regards, Philippe

Metadata tag guidance 2.pdf

[pdussart]

This is already working. Please check the function Rename: Menu->Edit->Batch Rename(Move)->...

You can use these variables in the Assign Tag Presets function to create e.g. the Title Tag "Photo%filename_%lat_%lon"

 

 

This is a function already available in the official 5.0 version, ready to download today

 

Regards, Uwe

 

Uwe,

 

I was thinking of the Properties screen for variables.

With PhotoStudio, you can use variables to fill for instance:

 

Title: Photo %%filename%%. Brussels market with Christmas tree. Author: %%Author%% Date:%%Date Created%%

Result is Photo 80356. Brussels market with Christmas tree. Author: Philippe Date: 2016-12-22

 

Description: %%Title%%

Result is Photo 80356. Brussels market with Christmas tree. Author: Philippe Date: 2016-12-22

 

See example in attachment (copies of the free version of PhotoStudio)

 

Obviously, this is linked with my request 1) regarding availbility of an extended set of EXIF/IPTC tags

 

Regards, Philippe.

[pdussart]

Uwe,

 

See document in attachment.

 

I am speakng of two dates, I am using only Original and Modified. In fact three distinct dates should be managed.

 

- Date/time original specifies when a photo was taken

- Date/time digitized specifies when an image was digitized

- Date/time modified specifies when a file was modified by the user

 

 

 

Information for Date/Time (Original):

Exif DateTimeOriginal (36867, 0x9003) and SubSecTimeOriginal (37521, 0x9291)

IPTC DateCreated (IIM 2:55, 0x0237) and TimeCreated (IIM 2:60, 0x023C)

XMP (photoshop:DateCreated)

 

Digitized Date/Time – Creation date of the digital representation

Exif DateTimeDigitized (36868, 0x9004) and SubSecTimeDigitized (37522, 0x9292)

IPTC DigitalCreationDate (IIM 2:62, 0x023E) and DigitalCreationTime (IIM 2:63, 0x023F)

XMP (xmp:CreateDate)

 

Modification Date/Time – Modification date of the digital image file

Exif DateTime (306, 0x132) and SubSecTime (37520, 0x9290)

XMP (xmp:ModifyDate)

 

Regards, Philippe

 

 

Uwe,

 

any reaction ??

 

Could you comment the PDF file that I sent in attachment ??

 

Regards, Philippe

[Uwe]

Hello Philippe,

sorry, but I can't comment the PDF document. I'm a user like you. This can be done the the Daminion team only.

I "played" a little bit with the variables and found some gaps and bugs.

I understand your point of view regarding the handling of the date taken.

But I don't know any other software that protects the Exif data like DateTime original etc. As far as I know e.g. Adobe Lightroom allows to adjust this date and the ExifTool too.

Regarding versioning. This is a function of the Daminion Server and allows to keep all adjustments you made as versions of your original source file. That means your original file was taken 01.01.2017 20:00:00 and you want to change the date. Then you create a new version of the file, make all adjustements and save it. You can enter your own comments to describe what you have done in this version.

Regards, Uwe

[pdussart]

Hello Philippe,

sorry, but I can't comment the PDF document. I'm a user like you. This can be done the the Daminion team only.

I "played" a little bit with the variables and found some gaps and bugs.

I understand your point of view regarding the handling of the date taken.

But I don't know any other software that protects the Exif data like DateTime original etc. As far as I know e.g. Adobe Lightroom allows to adjust this date and the ExifTool too.

Regarding versioning. This is a function of the Daminion Server and allows to keep all adjustments you made as versions of your original source file. That means your original file was taken 01.01.2017 20:00:00 and you want to change the date. Then you create a new version of the file, make all adjustements and save it. You can enter your own comments to describe what you have done in this version.

Regards, Uwe

 

Uwe,

 

I did not realize that you were a super user and not a Daminion person. I will try to redirect some of my questions to Daminion.

 

Thank you for all your suggestions.

 

Philippe

[Paul Barrett]

There are two different implementations to get information: by modal and non modal dialog. The modal dialog blocks the application as long as it takes to finish the started action (e.g. Assign Tag Presets). The non modal dialog works in the background/parallel and you can continue to work without to wait for the end of the started action (e.g. Rescan Folders).

Your request to get additional information in the middle of the screen means: modal dialog and you have to wait for the end of the action and you can't continue to work.

And you are right, there are feature requests to get more and detailled information about the current status of the prosess(es).

Regards, Uwe

 

Whoa! I don't want to be stopped from carrying other actions while the system is working. No way. If this is implemented it MUST be a user preference please.

 

- Paul

 

 

 

[Paul Barrett]

Uwe,

 

See document in attachment.

 

I am speakng of two dates, I am using only Original and Modified. In fact three distinct dates should be managed.

 

- Date/time original specifies when a photo was taken

- Date/time digitized specifies when an image was digitized

- Date/time modified specifies when a file was modified by the user

 

 

 

Information for Date/Time (Original):

Exif DateTimeOriginal (36867, 0x9003) and SubSecTimeOriginal (37521, 0x9291)

IPTC DateCreated (IIM 2:55, 0x0237) and TimeCreated (IIM 2:60, 0x023C)

XMP (photoshop:DateCreated)

 

Digitized Date/Time – Creation date of the digital representation

Exif DateTimeDigitized (36868, 0x9004) and SubSecTimeDigitized (37522, 0x9292)

IPTC DigitalCreationDate (IIM 2:62, 0x023E) and DigitalCreationTime (IIM 2:63, 0x023F)

XMP (xmp:CreateDate)

 

Modification Date/Time – Modification date of the digital image file

Exif DateTime (306, 0x132) and SubSecTime (37520, 0x9290)

XMP (xmp:ModifyDate)

 

Regards, Philippe

 

But what about scanned images?They always come into Daminion with a Creation Date Time of the date they were scanned regardless of the date of the subject. And many programs sort by that date so I need to be able to edit that date to an approximated origination date. I don't want photos taken in 1904 to appear in a 2017 timeline just because that's when they were scanned.

 

- Paul

[pdussart]

But what about scanned images?They always come into Daminion with a Creation Date Time of the date they were scanned regardless of the date of the subject. And many programs sort by that date so I need to be able to edit that date to an approximated origination date. I don't want photos taken in 1904 to appear in a 2017 timeline just because that's when they were scanned.

 

- Paul

 

Paul,

 

this is exactly my point. Daminion manages only one date.

 

Daminion uses a limited subset of EXIF/IPTC/XML standard tags.

 

See on this thread a PDF file regarding dates and recommendations. For a picture, the original "Date taken" should be protected and separated from a processing date (scanning date) or picture improvement with Photoshop or whatever)

 

Regards, Philippe

[Paul Barrett]

Paul,

 

this is exactly my point. Daminion manages only one date.

 

Daminion uses a limited subset of EXIF/IPTC/XML standard tags.

 

See on this thread a PDF file regarding dates and recommendations. For a picture, the original "Date taken" should be protected and separated from a processing date (scanning date) or picture improvement with Photoshop or whatever)

 

Regards, Philippe

 

Hi Philippe

Dates in Metadata are a complete nightmare. There are so many competing standards.......

 

But as long as you're not referring to the field called 'Creation Datetime' in Daminion I'm cool.

 

 

However, as a general principle i don't think we can mandate that a date CANNOT be changed. I can do it in exiftool regardless of any policy we apply in Daminion. My photos are my photos and I can edit what i want. I don't want a change to Daminion that makes me go and use exiftool to do what I can do much more easily in Daminion today.

 

However I DO think that more of the dates should be exposed in the Daminion Properties Panel. And be editable or not at the admin's choice in system preferences?.

 

I would fully support something along those lines.

 

- Paul

[K.C.Heine]

Thanks a lot for your input, Uwe, it helps a lot.

 

This is already working. Please check the function Rename: Menu->Edit->Batch Rename(Move)->...

You can use these variables in the Assign Tag Presets function to create e.g. the Title Tag "Photo%filename_%lat_%lon"

This is exactly what I was looking for.

 

But ... where do I find this one?

 

pdussart, on 19 December 2016 - 03:09 PM, said:

[...] Manage JPG and RAW tags of the same image in one go [...] Like in View NX (Nikon tool) [...]

 

This is a function already available in the official 5.0 version, ready to download today

I searched the UI over and over again, with no success.

 

Regards and thanks in advance

Kay

[Uwe]

But ... where do I find this one?

I searched the UI over and over again, with no success.

Hello Kay,

this function was implemented in an unofficial 5.0 build, available here in the forum. Because of the response, proposals etc. from the users Daminion wrote a short information (I can't find it right now) that Daminion has still to work on this function and therefore it's not in the official 5.0.

Please check this post: https://daminion.net/user-forum/index.php?/topic/3199-rescan-folder-1535/

Regards, Uwe

[Paul Barrett]

There are two different implementations to get information: by modal and non modal dialog. The modal dialog blocks the application as long as it takes to finish the started action (e.g. Assign Tag Presets). The non modal dialog works in the background/parallel and you can continue to work without to wait for the end of the started action (e.g. Rescan Folders).

Your request to get additional information in the middle of the screen means: modal dialog and you have to wait for the end of the action and you can't continue to work.

And you are right, there are feature requests to get more and detailled information about the current status of the prosess(es).

Regards, Uwe

 

I'm changing my position on this one.

 

I can see both sides to this argument. Mostly I do not want to be prevented from continuing to work; but I do want to be prevented from carrying out an action that could damage the catalog or the files. For example, if syncing is going on, should I be allowed to move files between folders? (That may not be a good example, but I'm sure you'll understand what I mean.)

 

- Paul

[Uwe]

Hello Paul,

yes you are right and this is also my position.

The main topic is: is each Daminion function implemented to fulfill in any case all of the requirements of a multi-user system working with parallel processes AND is this the approach Daminion wants to fulfill today? Both answers from my point of view is: no. And this is not a negative point from my point of view.

The result is: the users have to be careful in what they are doing using some functions, if not restricted by user roles. E.g. your example or also the action "Read Tags from file" until an "assign tags" process is still running in the background.

Regards, Uwe