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doubling tag groups


Szymon
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I found following behavior in Daminion during tagging of my pictures:

Situation:
1. I created several groups of tags in "Scene". For example "Tag_group_1" with tags "Tag_1_in_group_1", "Tag_2_in_group_1" etc...
2. First I was populating those tags (located in groups) by dragging to "Tags" window or by "Assign Tag mode" in "Tags" window.
3. After some time I started also to assign above tags by typing in "Properties" window.
 
Issue:
1. I see that I have doubled tag groups. In "Tags" window I see that:
-  pictures assigned via "Tag" window are in tag "Tag_1_in_group_1" located inside group "Tag_group_1".
- pictures assigned via "Properties" window are in tag "Tag_group_1\Tag_1_in_group_1" that is not in any group. 
2. When looking into the metadata I see that:
- pictures assigned via "Tag" window have "scene" metadata as "Tag_1_in_group_1".
- pictures assigned via "Properties" window have scene metadata as "Tag_group_1\Tag_1_in_group_1".
3. Tags created by assigning pictures in "Properties" window don't show any expanding list behavior that one would expect from group. I just see two tags next to each other, for example "Tag_group_1\Tag_1_in_group_1" and "Tag_group_1\Tag_2_in_group_1" that don't behave as they were in one group. 

Please let me know if this is any known behavior or bug. Is there any workaround available? 
 

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13 hours ago, Szymon said:

Please let me know if this is any known behavior or bug. Is there any workaround available? 

Not sure, if the following also applies to the Events tag, but I assume the following is true for all hierarchical tags.  I did stop using Groups, even though there are still some in my catalog. There a couple of things to consider:

  • The Group is never written to metadata. The workaround is not use groups, but a simple hierarchy instead. The a top level hierarchical tag instead,  is written to metadata.
  • In the properties panel, you see only the lowest level tag of a hierarchical tag or a tag inside a group. If you hover over the tag, you can see the hierarchy and/or group
  • If you re-import an image (or a copy of it) after metadata including a grouped tag were written to it, if the to level is not a group, but only a normal top level hierarchical tag, it should work correctly, provided in Preferences the options in Reading Metadata are set correctly.
14 hours ago, Szymon said:

3. Tags created by assigning pictures in "Properties" window don't show any expanding list behavior that one would expect from group. I just see two tags next to each other, for example "Tag_group_1\Tag_1_in_group_1" and "Tag_group_1\Tag_2_in_group_1" that don't behave as they were in one group. 

What are settings in Preferences -> Reading Metadata? For a standalone catalog, you fin those under Edit->Preferences and for a shared catalog of the server version, it is under Daminion Server Administration-> Administration->Preferences F10. The screenshot below shows my settings, but I am not sure what the default is:

grafik.png.49652390d59938b3a0ff91b44bf4731b.png

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Quote

What are settings in Preferences -> Reading Metadata? 

They are the same as you indicated. 

I played with this issue a bit more. The bug/feature I described is not present in "Keywords" tags and "Categories" tags. For them the picture tagged via "Tags" window or "Properties" window is behaving the same. It it always properly assigned to the group and metadata indicates only tag information (no group information).

 

Quote

I did stop using Groups...

This is probably the best solution :). Looks like I should switch to hierarchical tags... but after checking I see there is no option for creating hierarchical tags in "Scene" :D. When using right-click there is no option ctrl+Ins (create tag in "tag_name"). When trying to use "Properties" window and add "|" sign, Daminion is not accepting it.

Really starting to wonder if this is bug or some very badly introduced (with bugs 😉 ) feature.

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3 hours ago, Szymon said:

I see there is no option for creating hierarchical tags in "Scene"

Szymon, I confirm, at least for Home Server 6.8 (2344), although you can create groups for the Scene tag, but there is no Add Inside Tag 'xxx' Ctrl+Ins.

You should mention what version and build you are using and report it as a bug.

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 You should report it under the title 'Scene Tag doesn't allow hierarchy'. I don't know, if it is a bug or a permanent restriction (= 'feature' 😉 ), but the Daminion team should be able to tell us. In my opinion, if a group is possible, a hierarchy should work too. 

If it cannot be solved soon, the workaround would be creating a custom tag. I can can confirm, you can use a hierarchy, if you specify 'Tag values can by hierarchical'.

I never saw a reason to use the scene tag. Probably true for many other users and the bug never appeared to anybody.

 

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Hello, 
A group is not the same as a hierarchy. They won't be written in the metadata.
Groups are for convenient visual presentation of tags in the tags tree (as you can see in the Media format tag). 

The problem with the tag "Scene" you described in the first post has been solved in version 6.8. If you use the earlier version than 6.8, please, update the Daminion and let me know if it works for you.

Kind regards, Kate.

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1 hour ago, Katerina Karpenko said:

The problem with the tag "Scene" you described in the first post has been solved in version 6.8

Katerina, I was able to reproduce it in Home Server 6.8 (2344). What build are you referring to?

Thanks,
Wilfried

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I suspect you are now talking about two different issues :).

Kate mentioned bug described in my 1st post (adding "\" and hierarchy-like tag name in case of assigning grouped tag via "Properties" window" 

If I'm correct, Wilfried confirmed that also in his case the "scene" tags don't have option for creating proper hierarchical tags.

@Kate - when checking in "check for updates online..." I see information "running: 6.7.0.2250, available online:  6.7.0.2250". When clicking "download" I see option for downloading 6.8, but only for server version. I bought and use standard version.

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15 hours ago, WilfriedB said:

Katerina, I was able to reproduce it in Home Server 6.8 (2344).

Hello Wilfried,

The problem was: extra entry (Group_name\value name) was created if the value was chosen in the Properties panel via the dropdown hint.
That problem was reproduced for tags "Scene" and "Author".
Please let me know if you have it now in 6.8. 

Regards, Kate.

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2 hours ago, Katerina Karpenko said:

Please let me know if you have it now in 6.8. 

Sorry Katerina, I misunderstood your post yesterday.

Correct, an extra entry is not created in 6.8 (2344), when I select from the drop-down hint.  However, besides the fact, you cannot create hierarchical entries, I see some strange behavior with the scene tag in the properties panel:

  • Entering a string including a forward slash creates a single tag ('Test/Szene'). This consistent with the behavior for the categories tag (although I was believing, it should create a hierarchy in categories)
  • Keying a backslash ('\') is not possible in scene - this makes sense, since (unlike for the category tags), you cannot create a hierarchy. But if you enter the string including \ somewhere else and copy & paste it into the scene tags, it works and creates a single entry ('test1\Szene1' in my example).
  • After saving, you see both entries 'test1\Szene1' and 'Test/Szene' in the tags tree, but in the properties panel it shows like Szene1 Test/Szene:grafik.png.fc110de19189eee8ebfc1834f9c5e6cb.png

thanks
Wilfried
 

 

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Hello Katerina

When clicking link for client version in this post I have following message:

 

Quote

 

Sorry, this file is infected with a virus

Only the owner is allowed to download infected files.

 

 

As for lack of ability of creating hierarchical tags in "Scene", can you let us know if this is design choice or a bug?

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Hello,

Sorry about the inconvenience. All .exe files are highly suspicious for browsers. It is into the .zip archive now.

Some tags can not be hierarchical: Authors, Copyright, Scene, Genres, Artists, Composers.
It is not a bug. You can create a custom tag with a hierarchy for any purpose.

Regards, Kate.

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On 3/15/2021 at 3:33 PM, Katerina Karpenko said:

Hello, 
A group is not the same as a hierarchy. They won't be written in the metadata.
Groups are for convenient visual presentation of tags in the tags tree (as you can see in the Media format tag). 

The problem with the tag "Scene" you described in the first post has been solved in version 6.8. If you use the earlier version than 6.8, please, update the Daminion and let me know if it works for you.

Kind regards, Kate.

Hello,

yes, group is written to the file - maybe a bug.

20210317_110114.jpg


Example: Define a Group "Test_Group" in the Keywords. You can't assign the item to the group by drag and drop BUT you can assign the group to the item by right click on the group tag:

20210317_105915.jpg

regards, Uwe

 

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